+100.000 miles with the RCZ R (my story)

RCZ-R wrote:

The next task on the R-to-do list is to decoke the engine.
I finally found few specialists over here in ze Germany. Most of them are working on the Minis. But at the end the engine, at least the intake, should be almost the same with my RCZ. THP equals THP.

I'm really curious to see the level of residue in the intake ports. Over 100k miles of grime are sitting in there
And you can feel how much power the engine lost over time.

It would be good if they can show you the ports before and after, this will be very interesting RCZ-R and many will be awaiting your future posts - including me with my mere 12K miles !!

Plecodoras wrote:

It would be good if they can show you the ports before and after, this will be very interesting RCZ-R and many will be awaiting your future posts - including me with my mere 12K miles !!

Yep. Pictures are a must.
I have an endoscope with a recording device so I could use it if they do not supply any devices. But from what they told me over the phone, they provide this kind of service for customers.

Meanwhile I also started to add injector cleaners to the fuel and it helped to improve engine's performance a bit. But we all know, the dirty devil sits in those intake ports.

So, my fellow RCZ brothers & sisters. The first round of decoke on my R is done.

I opted for a chemical treatment first. It was due to the fact that access to the intake in our RCZ isn't the easiest one. Therefore we gave it a try with chemical treatment via intake system first.

On the pictures below you can see how this is done. A nozzle is hooked up to the intake pipe, a long stretch before the turbo inlet (important! you don't want to spray anything directly into the turbo inlet). Then pressure is applied to the device and it starts to spray a fine mist of a chemical deterrent into the intake while the engine revs at about 2500 rpms constantly.
This treatment is able to clean up the whole system, starting from the clean side of the intake, through the intercooler and up to engine's intake.
A session takes about 20 to 30 minutes. Afterwards you go for a test drive.

Results?
A remarkable improvement! First I was very skeptic about the results but on my way back from the shop I was able to feel a difference in in-gear acceleration. I haven't try top speed yet cause we have here constantly +35°C and this is not an environment I'd like to put her into at full blast. But definitely it helped a bit. It feels like the engine gained back about 10% of its lost power and torque.

But I won't stop there. As I will be keeping the R for few more months, I'm going for the next stage of this whole decoke. Which is to blast those intakes with a new type of blasting media.
I have opted for this treatment:
http://www.tunap.co.uk/

I will schedule an appointment during August and then we will see if this finally brings her back to old glory. I want to see that 167 MPH again on my mobile device

[RCZIain]

I'm skeptical about these chemical cleans.
How do they clean the intake valves on a direct injection engine?

On a non di engine the fuel washes over and cleans them, but in a di engine this is impossible due to design.

Sent from my VFD 710 using Tapatalk

RCZIain wrote:

I'm skeptical about these chemical cleans.
How do they clean the intake valves on a direct injection engine?

On a non di engine the fuel washes over and cleans them, but in a di engine this is impossible due to design.

Sent from my VFD 710 using Tapatalk

Yes, agree. The missing solvent on the intake side (which fuel is, on indirect injection engines) is the whole reason for the carbon build up on intake and intake valves on DI engines.

Now this very chemical treatment "simulates" an indirect injection by injecting the chemicals into the intake ports. The turbo charger pushes this very fine aerosol forward all through the intercooler up to the intake ports, right into the combustion chamber pass those intake valves. This is what the washing process here is.
Yes, a treatment like this is very unlikely to solve all residue and gunk in the intake. But it solves some. And definitely cleans the throttle body and few other parts on the way into the intake ports.
It'd rather be applied each second annual service to prevent from carbon build-up in first place rather than to attempt to solve it hundred of thousands miles later. This is because it can only work properly as long as the build-up doesn't become multilayered gunk sticking to all parts in the intake ports. Then only brute force helps.

I did not expect this one-time treatment to remove all the build up from my engine. But it did help though.

And this is why I will blast those intakes with tunap soon to get the shiny new.

On my next car with DI I'm going to do this kind of chemical treatment right from the start each and every 20k miles. This is a wise investment into preventing from serious carbon build up.

UPDATE ON THE ENGINE DECOKE:

So, time is flying by and I finally found a proper company to do the engine decoke. To disclose the details right at the beginning, no, it wasn’t in Germany. I had to go to Poland to make it happen. I was on a business trip to Warsaw so it came all together quite nicely. The garage shifted other appointments to have a free spot for me on a short term. And when I arrived at 7.30 in the morning at their gates, I learnt the very mechanic to take care of my RCZ got a child and his wife is in the hospital. But he stayed professional and sticked to the assignment. Later during the day I told him, man, just leave the car, go to your wife! He still was very dedicated to my RCZ and kept telling me, she is fine, I’m being kept up to date and she gave birth two days ago. So I know what is going on.
The chap was so gentlemanlike. Not the stereotypical image of a car mechanic, haha.

Alright, we got going with the RCZ. First, notebook hooked up to the ECU and checking for errors. Yes, we got one. Error P0299 pointing to a turbo pressure leak. Already by this point he got suspicious and said to me, listen, I know you are here because of decoking but due to my experience and the numbers I see here on the notebook, I don’t think it is down to a clogged engine. There must be something wrong with the exhaust side of the turbo.
By the time he dropped that bomb memories returned when months ago I insisted on checking the waste gate while talking to the service manager at Peugeot during annual service. But they never touched it and claimed the error is caused by something else. They very keen to replace parts which I prevented.
And then you hear something like that and it hits you hard. I was right!

The next info he gave me was, the values I see here while on idle and while accelerating do not point to a clogged engine. Absolutely not.
Still he started taking the intake side of the engine apart and later he was able to insert a cam into the intake. And voila, the pictures you see below show the level of residue.
My engine is not clogged! Speeding pays off, hahaha. He said, there is hardly any residue on the intake valves and the intake itself. He even showed me a sensor he took from the intake which was pretty clean. You could see a bright green plastic nose on the sensor which otherwise would be dark brownish, if clogged. If I remember correctly it was the pressure sensor.

Yes, there is some residue on the intake ports and a small bump on the intake valves (I point the arrow on it) but it wasn’t worth cleaning it and taking another 6 hours of this chap’s life while his wife and child are in the hospital. So we decided to skip the decoke.

But as polite and scrupulous he was he insisted on checking the turbo. The error he found on the ECU was suspicious. He took it apart and we have been able to diagnose a leak on the waste gate. Theory proven! We then contemplated if to take the turbo right away to a specialist and let it overhaul. But then it would mean I have to take a hotel or rental car for the next 2 days (yes, only 2 days wait for a service like this, that is pretty quick!) and it would screw my other appointments and plans. So we stepped back from it.
Still he managed to regulate the valve a bit more into the closing position and it helped to keep the boost for longer period. The car now holds boost more consistently and the P0299 error doesn’t pop up that often. Now you have to push the engine for a longer period flat out at +130 MPH to provoke this error. If you are more cautious with the accelerator, then the car still climbs up to 155 MPH and holds it there nicely.

To wrap it up, it was a good day, we achieved an improvement and I learnt the very reason why my RCZ doesn’t make it to over 155 MPH anymore. Now I have to make up my mind on the turbo overhauling. Do I go for it or is it something the next owner has to take care of (full disclousure when selling the car). We will see. I havent decided yet. All is dependant on the fact for how long will I keep the R with me. She is still around me although the plans have been to replace her by mid of 2018. But honestly, I’m having hard times to let her go. There is just nothing on the market available that touches my soul. OK, exepct for the new Alpine A110. But then again, the Alpine as a daily driver would be a bit over the top.

Cheers

RCZ-R wrote:

There is just nothing on the market available that touches my soul. OK, exepct for the new Alpine A110. But then again, the Alpine as a daily driver would be a bit over the top.

Agreed - it’s hard to find something that matches RCZ.

Incidentally, I’m told by someone who’s driven the new Alpine, it’s nothing special.

Do you have any details on the path he used to insert the endoscope? I've got one as well and wouldn't mind taking a look at my intake valves.

pete.garratt wrote:

Agreed - it’s hard to find something that matches RCZ.

Incidentally, I’m told by someone who’s driven the new Alpine, it’s nothing special.

What? That would be a surprise. A bad surprise. I'll try to get a test drive

drdino wrote:

Do you have any details on the path he used to insert the endoscope? I've got one as well and wouldn't mind taking a look at my intake valves.

I have not watched the whole process of taking the intake apart. But he took off all the piping to the left of the engine. And then inserted the camera on the back side of the engine. It wasn't long till he touched the intake valves.

RCZ-R wrote:

What? That would be a surprise. A bad surprise. I'll try to get a test drive

Hi, did you ever take that test drive in the Alpine?

renegade79 wrote:

Hi, did you ever take that test drive in the Alpine?

Not yet.
In general taking test drives in Germany is not that easy. Sure, for a euro sh--box like a VW polo or similar there is no issue to get a test drive. But as soon as it gets more extraordinary, the dealers are not very eager to give test drives. They act like, first put the money on the table and then I will give you the keys.

But I know a good renault dealer in my region and will ask him, if he has one for a test drive. Can't wait to give it a try!

Good to hear that the age old "Italian tune up" is still working it's magic in keeping engines clean..

Yes, indeed.
But my days with the lovely R are slowly coming to an end. Soon I will put her up for sale. Maybe even before xmas time. Sad, sad times.

Any sign of a replacement?

RCZ-R wrote:

Yes, indeed.
But my days with the lovely R are slowly coming to an end. Soon I will put her up for sale. Maybe even before xmas time. Sad, sad times.

Stick it in your garage and lock her up......

In years to come you will remember the times you had together, like and old girlfriend and want to re-live them all over again, plus they will be as rare as hens teeth in the future when we are all driving electric or hydrogen cars, you'll be able to show the young 'ens what a real car looks and drives like !!!

Sad day +1

Cheers M..

[neilgsxr69]

Plecodoras wrote:

RCZ-R wrote:

Yes, indeed.
But my days with the lovely R are slowly coming to an end. Soon I will put her up for sale. Maybe even before xmas time. Sad, sad times.

Stick it in your garage and lock her up......

In years to come you will remember the times you had together, like and old girlfriend and want to re-live them all over again, plus they will be as rare as hens teeth in the future when we are all driving electric or hydrogen cars, you'll be able to show the young 'ens what a real car looks and drives like !!!

Sad day +1

Cheers M..

How many old girlfriends have you got locked in yer garage Mick?

neilgsxr69 wrote:

Plecodoras wrote:

RCZ-R wrote:

Yes, indeed.
But my days with the lovely R are slowly coming to an end. Soon I will put her up for sale. Maybe even before xmas time. Sad, sad times.

Stick it in your garage and lock her up......

In years to come you will remember the times you had together, like and old girlfriend and want to re-live them all over again, plus they will be as rare as hens teeth in the future when we are all driving electric or hydrogen cars, you'll be able to show the young 'ens what a real car looks and drives like !!!

Sad day +1

Cheers M..

How many old girlfriends have you got locked in yer garage Mick?

Now that is just temptingly waiting for a response with some words like these put into a manageable order....

No I just can't there would be to much backlash.....

So, unfortunately with girlfriends Neil they don't look the same 20 / 30 years on, so I sold them too !!

renegade79 wrote:

Any sign of a replacement?

I'd love to take the new 508 GT 225 but they got some production issues delaying the availability for another 6-9 months. By another 9 months I'd be in the market for the upcoming 508 R Hybrid. Which will definitely be the better choice.

Then I also wait for the prices on the S60 limousine. I felt in love with recent Volvos after I had few of them as rental cars. It is a totally different class of car, not even 10% of the sportiness you get with the RCZ R, but still I got very impressed. This is a car that would settle me down on hi speed driving, haha.
The new S60 looks gorgeous. I hope the price for the T5 (250bhp) will not exceed 40k EUR. That would make the final calculation quite nice.

And then there is still my old "buddy", the Lexus brand. I still own an old LS which is in an immaculate condition. A bit too good to be again my daily driver. I downgraded her from daily to sunday driver few years ago. I could do the same to my RCZ R, still contemplating about that. But back to Lexus. I felt in love with the ridiculous RC F. That V8 engine and its sound. And how it drives. Just the perfect GT for me. And capable of +190 mph if one wants to taste that.

So, three choices. Favs by the order of appearance.

Plecodoras wrote:

Stick it in your garage and lock her up......

In years to come you will remember the times you had together, like and old girlfriend and want to re-live them all over again, plus they will be as rare as hens teeth in the future when we are all driving electric or hydrogen cars, you'll be able to show the young 'ens what a real car looks and drives like !!!

Sad day +1

Cheers M..

I already was and still am able to show the R greatness to all of our kids. They love it! They are all in total 6 of them from like 2 years old up to 11 (not all of them are mine, I got brothers and sisters). And there is always the fight about who is gonna ride in the R You all know, just 3 places to share between them.
Most of them learned driving a car on the R. I showed them how to steer, change gears. Funny though, the girls did the best

I don't know if I will keep her. Honestly I do not want to horde cars like a collector. Those need to be taken care of, driven , maintained, mot, etc. It takes time & money. We will see.